This kind of relates to Clayton's last post, but as I read the assigned chapters, i felt that the end wouldn't happen with Dean doing something bad, but Dean not doing something or neglecting to do something for Sal. I feel like their bond is too strong for Dean to actually betray Sal, as was evidenced on page 227, when Sal and Dean pick up the kids from St. Bonnaventure, and when asked if Dean was his brother, Sal said yes...thoughts/comments?
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WEll i was little confused about what you said, but from what i could figure out, i disagree. I think that the book has to end with Dean doing something bad and the whole friend group turning away from him. This is evident when Sal and his friend were gonig to go to Mexico when they get word that Dean wnats to come on the trip. Sal looks at his friend and they both are unsure about whether they should let Dean come on the trip with them. This shows how Sal is now unsure about how stable Dean is and if Dean is worth the trouble.
Throughout these chapters he calls Dean his brother a couple of times. I think their relationship is more brotherly than friendly. They have known each other forever, since they grew up together. They also seem to treat each other like brothers in the ways that they hate and love each other at times, when they are fighting or laughing etc. And no matter what happens on their journey they will still remain friends, or so we think. Just the way that family will always be family no matter what.
I agree with Kristie in that their relationship is more familial then friendly. It has come to the point that Sal can forgive Dean for doing anything, and at the same time he acts as an older brother. This is evident when they meet one of Dean's old friends and Sal remarks that he must have been an older brother to Dean once as well. Also when Dean crashes the car in the ditch, after Sal told him to slow down, Sal is barely angry, proving that he truly does treat him like a brother. Therefore I think that Dean is going to have to do something very drastic to break their friendship apart, because it seems as if nothing can come in the way of their bond, thus far.
I definitely agree with what Kristie and Olivia are saying about the brotherhood that Sal and Dean share. However, I always notice that its not Dean who says that he and Sal are brothers, but Sal always says that they are. I think that the attachment Sal feels towards Dean will never be broken because Sal looks up to Dean as if he is an older brother. Whatever stupid things Dean does, Sal always forgives him or doesn't make a big deal out of it.
I definitely agree with the familial bond between Dean and Sal, as Kristie pointed out and as Olivia and rebecca further explained. As this book is written in first point of view (Sal's POV), we get an excellent idea of SAL's world, or the world he sees through his eyes. We read through his thoughts and feelings and we know his own personal beliefs more than those of any other character. So Charlie, when you ask whether Dean will do something bad and betray Sal, I'm caught between the two- I feel like the way we know Dean- through his ups and his downs and all the crazy stuff he does- it seems logical that he would betray Sal in the end and just show his true colors.. BUT at the same time, Sal knows Dean better than anyone else and for that reason, the bond they share is whole and true..as in nothing can break it.. no matter what Dean does to screw things up, Sal can always see the good in him that no one else can see...
I agree with everyone that the relationship between Sal and Dean is like a family relationship. However, I still think that Dean will do something that could probably ruin the relationship between them. It could happen directly from Dean's actions, meaning that Sal cannot take Dean and his actions any longer. This would kind of be something more of an event that leads to Sal not being able to continue his brother-like relationship with Dean. However, it could also happen indirectly because of Dean's actions. Going back to what Katie said, about Sal always seeing the good in Dean, well this could be Sal's flaw, that actually leads to other things happening, and as a chain reaction, it forces Sal's relationship with Dean to end. Essentially, this could be Sal's "tragic flaw" so to speak, that leads to the end of the relationship with Dean.
I think that Becca brought up an interesting point. Considering that Sal is the only one who calls them brothers, and that it is in Sal's POV, their bond could be portrayed as more loving and strong than it actually is. In that case, it would be more likely that Dean betrays Sal. He may not feel as obligated to stay loyal to their friendship.
hi guys
i do think sal and dean are brotherly towards each other.. dean the neglegant, and sal the protective or possibly the inferior who looks up to dean. either way, the fact that sal writes this in a first person narrative and like a stream of consciouness... i think sal would be more obvious about his feelings toward dean, like if they were negative. hes writing this after this all happened and i think if their friendship was destroyed by deans actions, dean would be perceived more negatively because of sal's bias. i dont know though, maybe he'd tell it all how it was - plus there is more evidence that dean will screw up than not, but if i were him and i was no longer friends with a character at the time i wrote an autobiography.. i wouldnt say very much good about that friend.but i havent had too much in common with sal yet so that doesnt mean very much
i disagree, i do believe that there is a brotherly connection between Sal and Dean, but I think that Sal calls Dean his brother because he wants to avoid the trouble of questioning eachothers past. Especially when the cops or an employer is involved. Its always easier to get out of a sticky situation if you call a madman your brother instead of your friend, because then people tend to assume that youre not totally insane. Between the lines, though, there's no doubt there's a brotherly connection, but this is evident in all best friend cases.
As far as the course of the novel goes, there's still another 30-something pages to go, so I'd like to continue with my prediction from the last post, that Dean will do something to mess up Sal's life.
i agree with everyone about the family relationship between Dean and Sal. The two share something that can be described as a love hate relationship. I think Dean also treats Sal in the way he does is because of this relationship they have together. It proves that Dean can be harsh on Sal and disrespectful at times but in the end they remain "brothers".
i'd also like to build on what Rebecca said..how Sal is the one that calls him his brother. We don't really know enough yet to see if Dean feels that Sal is like his brother, im guessing he does. But maybe Dean is eventually going to do something "unbrotherly" that makes Sal rethink this whole family relationship.
I agree with what Sami said. I think that some family members, if they really love each other like Dean and Sal do, can hurt eachother but still continue caring for eachother deep down. Its also possible though that Dean is a more selfish person and all the Beats seem sort of flighty actually so it could be that Dean just hurts Sal and doesn't take it seriously of think its a big deal.
I think you could describe their relationship as sort of brotherly... but I also think their relationship is one of convenience. They both love to be on the road and NEED to be on the road, and they kind of give each other an excuse to do so.
They do show loyalty, though, which is interesting. I think someone said that they "complete each other"? Not in responses to this question... but maybe a while ago in another post. I think this statement is very true. There is Sal the sentimental one and Dean who is not. Dean is, I think, kind of more lazy than Sal. He will drive miles and miles but he'll just sit around until he goes bankrupt and then just sit there twiddling his thumbs as "everything collapses." That's the expression Sal always uses. I think, most of all, we need to evaluate their ability to cope with these situations where "betrayal" might be possible.
i agree with benji and disagree with charlie. i do think that the book will end with dean betraying sal and the fact that sal called dean his brother is probably used to make it seem like it hurts that much more when dean eventually betrays sal. i think that sal views dean as his brother but dean does not view sal as his.
Although everyone makes good points, i have to disagree about Sal and Dean having a brotherly relationship, because Dean sells Sal out way to much to care about him in that kind of way. Dean and Sal definitely have a great connection to each other and they're always striving to get the same mentalities as each other, but this isn't a familial bond. I think the reason that these two are able to connect to each other so well is that they both have problems with relationships. Dean's problem with them is probably connected to the relationship he has with his father. Dean doesn't know how to cope with the fact that his dad left him which probably explains why he leaves his loved ones all the time. Like Dean, Sal is the type of person who is "in the now" and he gets too caught up in what is happening in the present to think about the future, like when he leaves Lucille to go to the West with Dean.
I have mixed feelings about the whole brotherly relationship between the two. Sal could be referring to Dean as a brother in admiring, yet love-hate kind of way. I am not sure if this even make sense, but could it not be just a colloquialism for a friend (albeit close friend), just how “brother” is used colloquially today. I find it interesting that right after the events of pg. 227 and after the introduction of Ed Wall, Sal thinks that Ed “used to be Dean’s older brother.” In fact, they “used to stand around on Curtis Street corners and whistle at girls.” From what I can gather from the brief part with Ed Wall, Ed is in many ways like Dean, and perhaps the brotherly relationship where Sal looks up to and is influenced by Dean mirrors the former relationship between Dean and Ed.
Rebecca raised an interesting point, that it is always Sa l who refers to them as brothers. I think that Sal sees their relationship as brotherly because maybe no matter what Dean does, Sal would never completely abandon him, like Dean's family did to Dean. That said, Dean might not refer to Sal as his brother because maybe Dean is going too fast too think about that sort of thing, while Sal, the sentimental one, might have reflected a bit on their friendship.
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