In Chapter 2 of RR, the reader gets a look into the past of Mr. Campbell and it becomes evident that while living in the West (Arizona), he "loses himself". He feels that all of the answers to his problems will be found in the East. However, once he gets there, he is just disappointed.
This can be compared to ON The Road where Sal lives in the East, but wants to go to the west to find himself. Once he gets there, he is also disappointed.
So maybe, the authors are trying to comment that there is no possible way or place to find oneself? And maybe this is forshadowing for the Wheeler's plan to Paris?
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I would have to say that there probably is a way to find oneself, however, I think more that it just spontaneously happens, as opposed to going out and trying to find oneself. Basically, one will accidentally find oneself, as opposed to spending all of this time looking for oneself, but never finding it. I am not saying that someone cannot find themselves by moving, etc., I am just saying that I think that it is more likely to happen when one least expects it to happen. As for the second question, I think that it is a possibility that Paris could be an attempt for Frank to find himself, but I think that if this is an attempt, then he will not end up finding himself.
I thought "weast" was an actual word for a second there.
I think it has a lot with a "Grass is always greener on the other side" king of thing. These characters are changing their physical location in hopes of finding themselves and happiness - they blame their physical circumstances for their condition. However, they actually do not know what they really want and are too irresponsible, immature, and/or oblivious to address the fundamental problems with their life and accept the burden or the reality of of their identity, and they end up feeling just as miserable as before. Yeah, I'm not sure if that was coherent.
I agree with Mr. Jacobs - and the authors, if we are to accept what Benjamin suggests - that actively and deliberately looking for an identity rather than letting it reveal itself spontaneously will likely prove futile.
I definitely think all this foreshadows the Wheeler's move to Paris.
Great question! I love the way this book and On The Road relate, and I was thinking about the same thing as I was reading Shep Campbell's history. Also, I agree with you guys on the foreshadowing thing. I definitely think this says something about how the Wheeler trip to Paris will go. I do think that the "rougher" feeling of the south at first appealed to Shep after his strict upbringing by his mother, but once he was there for a while the excitement wore off. He had spent so long trying to throw off this image of a snobbish easterner that I think he lost himself a bit on the way.
I think we definitely see this disappointment in both Shep and Sal. They were both so desperate to just go places. Both went in search of an identity for themselves, but I think the difference is that Shep wanted to change his image completely. He wasn't really interested in finding his TRUE identity... it was more of a hasty throwing off of the old one that had made his childhood sort of nightmarish. Both, however, seemed to travel so hastily and with such spontaniety that they missed important things on the way. I don't think the authors are trying to say that this identity is IMPOSSIBLE to find, but rather, the characters are either looking in the wrong places or just moving so fast that they can't actually LIVE enough to find any distinct identity for themselves. Their obsession with leaving places in search of new ones is their ultimate downfall because they just never pause to enjoy it.
Also, did anyone notice the similarities between how Shep and how Frank and April treat their children? It's like they're complete strangers. Is the author making a statement about how all children in the 50's were ignored like this? It's kind of tragic. Shep even says, "This time he had to admit that he'd felt a distinct, mild revulsion" (154).
(Sorry for the monster reply... I got a little carried away, I guess...)
That is an interesting note there. It is true that Sal and Shep both went on these cross-country journeys, and were not totally fulfilled by what they saw. However, Shep and Milly did seem to settle down at the estates they currently live in, while Sal had returned to the East. (On a side note, maybe the books are conveying the message that New York City is the place to be.) However, Shep still seems to have some weird problems, showing that he is not completely settled, such as his constant thoughts about April.
I agree and believe it may foreshadow failure for the Wheelers, or disappointment, only perhaps in this case they cannot turn back as they have spent most of their money moving to France and will need to acquire a job for a few months to get the money needed to come back to the US. All the while they will be even more miserable in Europe, and the kids as well. Of course I'm just guessing what might happen, if Europe is a disappointment to them. Then if they do come back Frank will need to find a new job and everyone will laugh at him for going with such an idea, and then if he says it was his wife's idea (which it was) then they will say that his wife is in charge of his life and that he is not a man because he cannot even take charge of his own actions.
I thought weast was a type of mutant bread mold.
i think that someone finds themselves within themselves, it is not a specific place that does it. people believe that they need a change in scenery and sometimes what people really need is some time alone with themselves to really think about what they want to do and who they want to be.
I sort of agree, although i don't think Mr. Campbell was so upset about it. He just accepted that the East wasn't so exciting, but he still thought it was what he needed. I think that this might relate to what the Wheeler's experience in Paris might be because it might be saying that moving, and going somewhere else, really does nothing discover oneself. It's about them as people, not their surroundings or where they go.
I definitely agree with Justin. I think what the authors are trying to convey is that no matter where you go, your problems don't change. Just because you move the setting of conflicts, does not mean the conflicts are resolved. I think we were touching upon this topic in todays discussion. Also, the authors are pointing out the fact that no one is really ever happy with what they have, as Clark pointed out. For example, originally Mr. Campbell just wanted to move west and live a different life, but once he arrived there he could only imagine his life in the east as it was before. This also occurred in On the Road. Because this theme reoccurs so often, I'm sure it will present itself once April and Frank move to Paris, if they even do.
Did you notice that Mrs. Campbell, when congrating April, said kids? I think that she is implying something, or that the author is telling us something. I agree that Mr. Campbell's past foreshadows Paris and how it will work out, though I doubt that April will actually go there in the end. Most kids never follow through
I agree with what most people are saying. To find oneself, you cannot just search in a different area of the country. Instead, you must look inside the depths of your soul and figure out who you are.
To answer Jasia's question...the fact that they both treat their kids similarly and that these children seem to be the true victims is definitely trying to prove a point. I'm not quite sure if it is saying that all children were neglected like that in the 50s, but instead just enforcing the point that a parent's acts can have profound effects on their children.
I think that the Wheeler's will find themselves "un-found" in Paris. Paris is simply a Band-Aid to cover the large laceration that is their relationship. It may stop some of the bleeding and angst, but it will eventually get soggy and fall off, thus leaving the family with another problem, and then a trip to the imagination for more Band-Aids (forgive me I'm tired). The only way to find oneself is really only at childhood and adolescence. One should know what to do with life by the time college comes around, and then we should exploit that discovery for our best interests. If that doesn't happen, we will be stuck without self-discovery, consumed by the responsibility and routine of adulthood.
Yes Jasia I think that there is a connection, and it was a trend of the 1950s to leave a kid to create his path, providing discipline and lessons along the way, however, Frank and April lack both of those traits, because they are so involved in themselves.
I have a small question, and it's not exactly related to the book but it's baffled me for years:
Why do parents always find it necessary to move to the suburbs when they have kids? What's so bad about the city or country? And if people are always so miserable, including the kids, why do they stay? Comments? This could be connected to the Wheeler's but I kinda want to know in general.
I agree with Justin and olivia with how changing the location doesn't fix the problems. I feel like right now, Frank and April are living in their own little fantasy world where all their marital issues aren't a problem anymore and it's all in the past. But like it was mentioned, just because they are in Paris doesn't mean its all gonna go away.
On a separate note, I thought it was interesting when April and Frank found Jennifer in her room sucking her thumb. Of the two of them, Frank seemed to show more compassion towards their children and he's the one who wonders if they should have thought more about the kids' feelings when planning the move.
Cedric good point with Mrs. Campbell calling them kids. I think it is referring to them being immature as the Campbell's discuss later in the chapter. Also I believe there is a connection of escaping between both the books On the Road and Revolutionary Road. Deep down i believe both the Wheelers and Dean and Sal believe they may never find themselves. They believe this escape may change up their lifestyle but they have to realize some things in life may never change and that includes finding who you really are.
I think that its meant to say that "home is where the heart is," Sal never settled, and was always dissapointed.
Campbell and Sal are almost opposite in their actions and, through them, their personalities (ability to settle, fear of commitment, etc). Thus I believe that the dissappointment matters less than how they cope with it. Campbellsettlesdown for his family's sake, which Sal could never do.
So I think that Sal cannot find himself because he never settles downto look at himself and his world. Campbell succeeds in settling, but dislikes what he sees. Frank may very well lose perspective in Paris and end up worse off. April wants him to "find himself," but that is not possible if she pressures him to move.
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