Old Woman Magoun

Hi guys
after reading Old Woman Magoun i had a few questions
my biggest confusion is in why nelson barry / jim wants lily
the grandmother guesses that he lost a card game andthats why he wants her
and then once nelson goes home to jim, he says "you better keep your promise"
clearly somethings going on that we dont know about - what does jim want with lily? to marry her? -- and is that the only reason woman magoun wants to keep lily away from her father? so that he doesnt marry her off because thats what happened to lily's mother and then she died? or does she just think hes a bad man

also... does she kill lily? because if she just wants to keep her away from nelson cause shes scared that she will die after being married off... how is killing her any different? either way she dies, and she could have potentially had a life different than her mother's.

do you think that old woman magoun killed her daughter too? because nelson says something like his wife had gotten sick from sour apples and milk before and it was really bad... so maybe thats just what magoun says to cover up that she killed both of them - cause with lily at least i think its the berries that do it.

last... what do you think the doll represents? at first i thought it was lily's innocense but then the grandmother holds it so maybe for lily its like her dead mother and for magoun its lily?
oh and... what do the blackberry vines represent? just death?

Kdramas

I am horribly annoyed that no one dare reply to my uber post!!!  So I will repeat the most important thing I said for it.  I have one invite to a great site AZNV.tv/en.  This sight lets you watch KDramas, so I could use this invite to make a class account.  Then everyone could watch the dramas and blog there too.  The blogs on AZNV are actually quite insightful...  Sometimes people do polls with the blogs, like once a someone wanted to get insight on what people though love is.  This could help benefit the class if we got a class account there and got more than just a 20 person inexperienced account on a book.  Also, did you know that there is a Korean wave spreading throughout the world???  That should convince you to watch!!!  If you're interested, then reply to this post.  I'll make the account if enough people are interested...

Here are sights so you can think about it...

kids

after frank picks up michael and niffer from the campbells' to tell them about their mother's death, all niffer says is "Mommy is in heaven and we went to a restaurant (p. 345)." do you think she says this b/c she can't truly grasp the severity of the situation, or b/c she doesn't really care (she never really paid the kids any attention), or another reason?

THE END

What'd you think of the last couple of chapters? did anything surprise you?

Also, who do you think was more affected by April's death? Frank or Shep?

Frank... although directly following her death, is compared to a drunk man that can hardly walk on page 335, doesnt seem to have a problem carrying on with his life. In fact, he even moves to the city and gets rid of his children aside from the weekend visits. In my POV, April's death allows Frank to live.

Shep on the other hand, will always remember exactly what he was doing in the moment that April died, and he cries over her, and is sickened by his wife's progressive need to gossip about it like its a soap opera and is if the campbells are the victims of this tragedy.

Lastly, do you think that April's note really had any affect on Frank? Without it would he have truly felt responsible? I personally dont think Frank is strong/man enough to take ever take responsibilty or feel guilty for his actions.

Frank vs. John

In the scene in chapter 5, Part 3 (p. 302) in which John is questioning the Wheelers' decision to stay in America, he says to April, "I'm beginning to feel sorry for him, too.  I mean come to think of it, you must give him a pretty bad time, if making babies is the only way he can prove he's got a pair of balls."

How true do you find this to be?  I think that it is pretty accurate; Yates usually talks about Frank's manhood in the highest regard when he's yelling at April, hitting her, or doing something primitive/raw.

Comparisons of Richard Yates' Writing Style in Revolutionary Road : The Blog Post

I believe that this was the assignment tonight, so I will begin. Someone alert me if I do something incorrectly.

Richard Yates' writing style is like a kaleidoscope. It offers many different, vibrant, and beautiful perspectives of what is essentially the same thing repeatedly(ie one views the same beads / pebbles over and over again as the kaleidoscope turns). Each view is distinctly unique, yet at the same time there is a clear relation between one image and another and a level of uniformity/conformity with all the images that can be formed.

Post your comparisons here.

WEST or EAST, mabye weast

In Chapter 2 of RR, the reader gets a look into the past of Mr. Campbell and it becomes evident that while living in the West (Arizona), he "loses himself". He feels that all of the answers to his problems will be found in the East. However, once he gets there, he is just disappointed.

This can be compared to ON The Road where Sal lives in the East, but wants to go to the west to find himself. Once he gets there, he is also disappointed.

So maybe, the authors are trying to comment that there is no possible way or place to find oneself? And maybe this is forshadowing for the Wheeler's plan to Paris?

Although there are larger topics that could be dealt with, i found it very peculiar (yet could see where she was coming from) that when April was introducing her plans of moving to Europe to Frank, she kept telling him not to laugh.  Since we all know that she wants him to refrain from laughing AT her, not WITH her in a giddy "we're going to Europe!" kind of way, i wonder why she even bothers saying this.  Since she knows his opinions of women being on the same level with men, and could probably guess that he'd find it somewhat amusing, i wonder 1)Why she bothers doing this, and 2)What gave her the courage to present such an idea to Frank? thoughts/comments?

Also, did anyone else find it weird that on page 122, April referred to Jennifer as "Niffer" instead of Jen or Jenny?

Hands

In chapter three of the book, while describing Frank's past, talks a lot about his father's hands. What do you think the reason for this is? Perhaps a foreshadow?

Golden Globe Awards

Hey you guys! I just thought this was exciting...

The film Revolutionary Roads has been nominated for four Golden Globe awards:

Best Director

Best Actor in a Motion Picture Drama

Best Actress in a Motion Picture Drama

Best Motion Picture Drama

Unfortunately, Sam Mendis, the director of Revolutionary Roads already lost. But let's hope for the best for the rest of the night!

Music

What song/music do you think best describes the relationship between Frank and April?  I think that when looking at Frank's POV, it is "SOS" by ABBA.  For April, I would say that it would be Dvorak's 9th Symphony (The New World Symphony) 4th movement.  :)

Taking Sides

Chapters 3 and 4 give us profound insight on our main characters, Alice and Frank, and the strained dynamic between them. After it seemed (at least to me) in Chapters 1 and 2 that Frank was most certainly the “bad guy”, Alice was definitely shown in a much more negative light in Chapters 3 and 4. I was surprised to learn that she had very seriously proposed what is tantamount to abortion.

Personally, I think that they are both at fault, and their actions are morally repugnant – especially considering the cost to their children. They are the real victims in this relationship.

What do you think? Which character is “right”, and who is more at fault for the troubles in the relationship? Are either of their behaviors justifiable or tolerable, especially considering their troubled pasts? Is it possible to sympathize with them at all?

I also found it interesting that, despite what Alice promised, their male child is named Michael, not Frank. This is likely one of many indications of April's fickleness.

Everything or Not?

I don't know if there is an new post about Revolutionary Roads and i thought we had to blog so here is the new blog:
April and Frank are supposedly very sucessful people and have the perfect life, at least in the 1950s perspective. Would you consider this life to be perfect in today's world?